After taking last year off to receive treatment for prostate cancer, Northwestern’s favorite sociology professor, Charlie Moskos, is back and irreverent as ever. His Introduction to Sociology class (so popular the registrar offered 600 spots this year), is a perennial freshman favorite. And he’s kinda famous off-campus as well. The Wall Street Journal called Moskos, 72, America’s “most influential military sociologist” when he created the controversial “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell” policy for the Clinton Administration. And Pentagon officials still have him on speed dial for military advice.
PLAY catches up with the self-proclaimed “fat, bald Greek” on what it’s like to be back in Evanston, how to fix Iraq and what practically every one of his former students wants to know: When is he going to retire?
SS: What are you researching right now?
CM: Oh, lots of stuff. Right now I’m co-authoring the third edition of my book about Greek-Americans [Greek Americans: Struggle and Success] with my younger son. I’m also writing a book called The Sociology of Soldiers. It’ll probably be out in 2009, and it’s about everyone and everything in the U.S. military-recruits, peacekeeping forces, combat soldiers, women, race relations, everything. Then I’m also writing an article called “Patriotism Lite,” probably for the New York Times. It’s sort of about people putting stickers on their cars saying “support the troops,” but no one’s making any real sacrifice.
SS: One of your very first published pieces, about soldier morale during the Vietnam War, appeared in the New York Times Magazine in 1967.
CM: It’s funny, because that story got me more prestige in the sociology department than any paper I’d written for a scholarly journal.
SS: What did you learn about American soldiers in Vietnam?
CM: The common wisdom at the time was that soldiers fought for their buddies beside them. But after I visited the troops in Vietnam, I found that you really have to believe in the just cause. You have to believe you’re fighting for a purpose. These guys didn’t.
SS: Do you think that’s what’s wrong with morale in Iraq?
CM: Yeah, soldiers there are fighting for their buddies to a large extent. The other difference with Vietnam is that so many people are doing repeat tours in Iraq. In Vietnam, you went for a year and knew you never had to go back. Also, soldiers in Iraq know there’s no sacrifice going on at home.
SS: What do you mean by “no sacrifice?”
CM: Well, during Vietnam, America had a gas tax and the draft, so soldiers overseas knew the people at home were suffering for the war too. That’s not the case in Iraq.
SS: Speaking of the draft, I’ve heard you want to bring it back. Why?
CM: Well, it’s not just a military draft I want. It’s really a three-tiered model of national service. You would have your traditional military draft, and then a homeland security branch, whose employees would work in airport security, border security, things like that. The third branch would be civilian service, an Americorps type of thing. People would teach in poor neighborhoods, help older people with their grocery shopping and drive sick people to the doctor.
SS: I know other countries have mandatory military service. Does it work there?
CM: Germany has it, and it works wonderfully. And they only keep the draft for the civil service branch. They don’t need the military draft anymore; it’s not like Poland’s going to invade anytime soon.
SS: Who do you like for 2008? Your former boss’ wife, perhaps?
CM: I liked Bill. I really did. But Hillary’s too hawkish for my tastes. A little too eager to go to war. None of the candidates really does anything for me at the moment, but I guess Obama would be my pick.
SS: You’re best known for creating the “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell” policy in 1993. Back in 2000, you told Lingua Franca the law would be gone in five years. It’s been seven years and it’s still here. Your thoughts?
CM: Well, it looks like we’re getting a Democratic president in 2008, so I think that will be the final nail in the coffin. There’s a dilemma either way, though. If we repeal it, military recruitment will suffer, because without a draft, we’re drawing soldiers from a largely homophobic population. But we could never have a draft with Don’t Ask Don’t Tell in effect, because then everyone would say, “I’m gay, I can’t serve!”
SS: You only teach at Northwestern in the fall. Where do you spend the rest of the year?
CM: In the winter, I live at home in Santa Monica.
SS: You don’t have a house here?
CM: Nope. I used to be able to handle the Evanston winters, but I’m old now. My wife and I stay at the Homestead [a hotel two blocks from campus].
SS: Okay, so you spend winter in California-what about spring and summer?
CM: That time I split between New York and Amsterdam, where my sons live, and vacationing on the Greek island of Lesbos. Do you know why it’s called that?
SS: No, but I am embarrassed for laughing at the word “lesbos” in front of my professor.
CM: Don’t worry about it. It’s called that because Sappho, the first recorded female writer and rumored lesbian, wrote about the island. But it’s still appropriate now because half the population is lesbian. I’ve been going there for 10 years, so I’m practically a lesbian now. But I’m pro-lesbian. They’re very quiet. Mikonos, which is the next island over, is a hotspot for gay men, and it’s pretty raucous and noisy.
SS: It’s rumored that this is your last year teaching at Northwestern. But the same rumor circulated last year and the year before. So let’s set the record straight-when are you really going to retire?
CM: Well, never, if I can help it. Even last year when I got prostate cancer, I always planned to come back. I’m going to teach here every fall quarter until I kick the bucket. What I’d really like is to keel over right in the middle of a lecture. Just have a heart attack and collapse in front of 500 students. How’s that for a way to go?
Medill junior Sarah Sumadi is a PLAY writer. She can be reached at [email protected].
